Interview with Don Alejandro (ca. 55 yo)

A: …Yes, because they say that they like us cultivate together, and rotate the crops in the communal aynuqa. In the two communities, in all of Qhunqhu. Sometimes… well there are always people like now… there are falling outs between families, between parties in dispute. In that case, as in a zone nowadays… we are in four zones, aren't we? And one forcibly has to commit oneself in order to have opportunities… commit oneself to politics… So that there weren't uprisings… And when there were uprisings, automatically they had to go into the prisons.

They headed the unions that were there. These, mm… the mm… landed estates (Sp. fincas), what are they called?, the patrones, their workers… the peones. Because before then in Bolivia there weren't these colonies, rather there were indigenous communities. Then, through the State, the patrones bought their portion from the State, just as if you yourselves were coming to Qhunqhu and could buy it from the State and we would be your servants.

They did this all over Bolivia, in all of Bolivia they divided it up, they bought it, they became the owners of all of it. And not only that, but the servility (Sp. pongeaje) on top of it. We had to serve the patron. We had to cook it for him. We had to work for him, three days for ourselves and three days for the patron.

So there was a barbarous exploitation.

So, automatically like a slave. But in Jesús de Machaca, it didn't come to that. It didn't come to that, it didn't come to it. And do you know why? It's because they were united, and well organized, as man to man, the two of them firm. They didn't let themselves be dominated. When they wanted to dominate this member, then this member stood up to them. And when they wanted to dominate this other member, that other member stood firm; the two of them defended each other in this way.

Besides, in order not to fall into this trap, Jesús de Machaca was bought from the Viceroy of Lima. So, as Bolivia was bought, so Jesús de Machaca was bought in the same way… It could have been a nation. Because we didn't belong to Bolivia. In that case, just as the Bolivian state was bought, so too, we the machaqueños bought it.

It was bought with twelve loads of gold, with twelve loads of gold on a llama. This was done on three occasions. There is a document, it must be there below. So, well, that's why there were three Machacas: San Andrés, Jesús and Santiago de Machaca. The patrones have never been able to do this to the three Machacas.

They didn't get to anyone. Not one of them, there are three brothers so. They didn't get to one of the Machacas. So, in the Revolution of 1952, we were like land owners too. Jesús de Machaca had a landed estate here in Chijcha.

Yes, yes, afterward we had a landed estate near the valley of Timusi: Kunkuni. It was called Kunkuni, that one. Then so, in the city we had a tambo (waystation), in order to get there. It was called tambo Viluyo. So, as Machaca was well organized, as it was solid, no-one could dominate it, as it had this… let's say it had an air of autonomy.

So, for that reason, the authorities only came to Machaca: as corregidor, as parson, as scribe, all of that. Then, through them, they dominated Machaca too. Here too in Ch'auch'a de Khulamarka this was their inheritance. The first village was there. In the colonial period, when the Spanish came, then that site was for recruiting people to go to work the mine in Potosí, to that mine in Potosí.

So, there was the unfortunate custom of the parsons, to get married you had to leave the brides, they had to be two weeks with the parson, with the priest [he, he…laughs], so, because of their anger the people couldn't put up with it any longer, and well, they killed the priest.

Here they killed him first, for that unfortunate thing they did… if not, it wouldn't have been like that. It would have continued being a village, Jesús de Machaca, the whole village. Perhaps it would have been a city by now… This is the history of our grandparents that exists.